A PC for less than £80.

[jimmy]

Just bought a new PC for less than 80 bucks.


1. Why?

My old desktop, at 7+ years old was positively geriatric. Been putting things off as usual.

Then it threw a wobbly and fryed the 3 SSDs I used for storage.

Really want to spend some time choosing my next PC and I hate being rushed. So I needed something in the meantime. Found this on Amazon.

amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B09KMV94YH/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

(A quick check. This unit is now almost 100 bucks and an 8Gb version is available for £150).

I've been checking at Mini-PCs for a while now. They look kinda neat. Most of the reviews I read were for units costing close on £1000, so not cheap.


2. What did I get for my £77.00?

A small box, measuring 9.5 x 9.5 x 2.5mm. It came with a PSU and an HDMI cable. The power draw is only 12 W. Nothing too much to worry about.

There doesn't seem to be any way to open the box, so upgrading is not going to happen.

There are two USB 3 ports. An micro SD card port, 128Gb max, HDMI, Ethernet and 3.5mm jack, sound ports. And an on/off button.

It came preloaded with Windows 10 pro.

Intel Atom CPU x5-Z8350, 1.44-1.92 GHz, 2 MB Cache ,4 cores, Intel HD Graphics, 200 MHz-500 MHz, Bluetooth, 2GB RAM, ROM:32GB, SD card slot.

The vendor said the default language can be changed in the BIOS. I can load Linux Mint onto the micro SD card.

With my printer and mouse connected, the inn is full. I may look into a usb multiport adapter but past experience of these wasn't good.

During setup, the external temp was about 40C. No problems there.

In normal running, it's about 30C, cooler than me!


3. Setting it up.

First job, remove all the M$ bloat. (Getting there!).Back in the days of XP I'd have turned off a load of services. Sadly, I no longer have the knowledge.

Installed better browser, (Chose Brave, excellent).

Micro SD card, 128Gb of course.

I've re-used my monitor and mouse. I may get a wireless mouse meaning I can use the USB port for something else.

Sadly, I can't remember how to set my PC wireless keyboard to connect to a new bluetooth. So I'm having to use a little 250 x 150mm Android thing designed for my tablet for the moment. It's a LogiTech MK250, if anyone knows how. I'd be grateful.

I've bought a 500Gb pen drive for storage. Waiting to arrive. I did consider buying more SSD drives, but the decent ones are too expensive for now.

In the meantime, the unit saves to OneDrive by default. This is fine, but causes the PC to slow to a crawl during transfer. Come to think of it, those with superfast Broadband, might not have such a problem.


4. Performance.

Once I'd gotten rid of most of the bloat, constant news feeds, silly M$ graphic extras, I'm pretty impressed.

It isn't by any means fast. But its a lot faster than my tablet.

Clicks often seem to take a moment to react. Nothing major. A second perhaps, but enough to notice.

YouTube plays without issues. The playback was smooth, no juddering at all.

Facebook is slow. Most news sites are very quick, Braves' ad blocker to thank there.

Keeping Edge, just in case. Once I'd turned off that ridiculous newsfeed, it does work a lot better. Though not a good as Brave

I really have to say, I'm very pleased with my £80 purchase. It's a lot better than I thought it would be.

This may sound picky, but I do miss the little flashing light on my old PC, which indicated that it was processing something.

The Sleep function doesn't work. It uses memory and that is in short supply here. That's most likely the reason. I can expect some other Windows functions to be affected.

Had a look at the manufacture's web site. isnunmu.com This product isn't listed. Presumably obsolete. (Know how it feels!)

[jazzazz]

Sounds like a great deal.

Besides the Chromebook, I am presently typing on, my favorite internet device, I have a MacMini as my desktop too.

But if and when that one goes belly up or eventually needs to be replaced, it will more than likely be a, "Chromebox."

Check those out on Amazon too.

I do not want ANYTHING Windows :-)

[jimmy]

Apr 29, 2022 15:20:52 GMT jazzazz said:

Sounds like a great deal.

Besides the Chromebook, I am presently typing on, my favorite internet device, I have a MacMini as my desktop too.

But if and when that one goes belly up or eventually needs to be replaced, it will more than likely be a, "Chromebox."

Check those out on Amazon too.

I do not want ANYTHING Windows :-)

Thanks again for another great tip Jazzazz.

This little unit is really just to keep me sane while I decide which PC to get frankly. Though I am so impressed, especially since it was less that £80, it is very slow. And as just about everyone says, it probably won't last that long. (But we shall see!! ).

Had a look at the Chromebox. Looks ideal. Heading toward the i7 to be honest. The prices and models do seem to vary. I like the ASUS brand. It was traditionally, the tough guy on the block. A recent purchase of an Asus notebook for my niece seems to have confirmed that.

I don't really play a lot of games, but I said that before I got my last PC. Then read Sapkowski's Witcher series and ended up playing the computer version!! Pointless aiming at lower power when beefier versions are within grasp. 

A quick look at the Asus site. They have a version 4. It seems it is available in Celeron or Intel core. So be comparing the various i7 versions.

Anyway, a good direction to go to. Thank you so much for the advice. I'm heading away from Windows, as you have done. Linux Mint is bookmarked. 

Addition.
Know what I like most about this little PC?
It's completely silent. No fans struggling away. 

[jazzazz]

The evolution of my Internet device travels, LOL, the first one for People living on the other side of the Pond :-), you may have to Google, was "WebTV," which all us EX WebTVer loved, so simple to use, hooked up to any TV, DummyProof, and invulnerable to anything. But then Microsoft bought it with the only intent to kill it, being they could not sell us anything else, no other software needed. Then came my first PC in 2006, a WindowsXP HP SLIMLINE. Once they stopped supporting "XP," I tried several Linux Distros, booting straight from Disc, until I settled on Mint 17, installing it. That one has been sitting, stored in our 2nd bedroom, also my Office and Drum room, until I get around to taking it apart to drill holes through the HD, but its' slimline design is a PIA to take apart to get to whatever. Might leave that task to someone else, once I'm on the other side (Soon 73, so how long can that be, LOL). Besides it is password protected, which I forgot which one I used long ago. Next for a desktop, replaced it with my MacMini, and along the way have had Chromebooks, on my second one, an Acer 15.6" model. Most of us EX WebTVers moved on to the simplicity of these CBs, also near Dummy Proof :-).

Also there have been tablets, a couple or three Androids, and now one Smartphone (This last July, that I could not pass up on Amazon, for under $80 on Amazon, an RCA Reno 32G, does all I need to do on one).

[mikkh]

Apr 29, 2022 15:20:52 GMT jazzazz said:

Sounds like a great deal.

Nope, it's terrible in oh so many ways.

Awful ultra slow CPU - like worse than a very low end desktop CPU of a decade or more ago

Onboard eMMC (or ROM as they call it) is basically a poor mans SSD and barely faster than clunky old mechanical drives in a lot of cases

2 GB RAM is not enough for a modern OS, unless it's a specialist lightweight Linux - definitely not enough for Mint.

It's the age old story - if it seems too good to be true, then guess what...... (it is)

There are some half decent mini PC's out there that won't break the bank though. I found several I'd happily use for 300 or less doing a quick search on Amazon.
I bought one second hand for £80 that had been upgraded to a real SSD and 12 GB of RAM, it also had a much better CPU and was a great little machine.
Sold it for £150 a couple of weeks ago, but I had to throw in a monitor.

If you need help in picking one, give me a shout and I'll point you in the right direction.

[jimmy]

Apr 30, 2022 15:00:30 GMT jazzazz said:

The evolution of my Internet device travels, LOL, the first one for People living on the other side of the Pond :-), you may have to Google, was "WebTV," which all us EX WebTVer loved, so simple to use, hooked up to any TV, DummyProof, and invulnerable to anything. But then Microsoft bought it with the only intent to kill it, being they could not sell us anything else, no other software needed. Then came my first PC in 2006, a WindowsXP HP SLIMLINE. Once they stopped supporting "XP," I tried several Linux Distros, booting straight from Disc, until I settled on Mint 17, installing it. That one has been sitting, stored in our 2nd bedroom, also my Office and Drum room, until I get around to taking it apart to drill holes through the HD, but its' slimline design is a PIA to take apart to get to whatever. Might leave that task to someone else, once I'm on the other side (Soon 73, so how long can that be, LOL). Besides it is password protected, which I forgot which one I used long ago. Next for a desktop, replaced it with my MacMini, and along the way have had Chromebooks, on my second one, an Acer 15.6" model. Most of us EX WebTVers moved on to the simplicity of these CBs, also near Dummy Proof :-).

Also there have been tablets, a couple or three Androids, and now one Smartphone (This last July, that I could not pass up on Amazon, for under $80 on Amazon, an RCA Reno 32G, does all I need to do on one).

Sharing fond memorys of XP. I will never understand what M$ thought they were doing when they dumped that for ME and Vista! Still, just goes to show, even the boffins get it wrong.

I have thought about going back to a laptop. The tablet I have is a Chinese beast. It's OK, but so very fiddly.

If your drum room is what it sounds like, I am officially envious. I'm a couple of years behind you and haver longed for a decent drum.

[jimmy]

May 1, 2022 1:22:06 GMT mikkh said:

Apr 29, 2022 15:20:52 GMT jazzazz said:

Sounds like a great deal.

Nope, it's terrible in oh so many ways.

Awful ultra slow CPU - like worse than a very low end desktop CPU of a decade or more ago

Onboard eMMC (or ROM as they call it) is basically a poor mans SSD and barely faster than clunky old mechanical drives in a lot of cases

2 GB RAM is not enough for a modern OS, unless it's a specialist lightweight Linux - definitely not enough for Mint.

It's the age old story - if it seems too good to be true, then guess what...... (it is)

There are some half decent mini PC's out there that won't break the bank though. I found several I'd happily use for 300 or less doing a quick search on Amazon.
I bought one second hand for £80 that had been upgraded to a real SSD and 12 GB of RAM, it also had a much better CPU and was a great little machine.
Sold it for £150 a couple of weeks ago, but I had to throw in a monitor.

If you need help in picking one, give me a shout and I'll point you in the right direction.

Appreciate every point you made. As I said, at this time, it's either this unit or getting to know the TV schedules. But hopefully not for long.

I take it you feel the same way about all the mini-pcs available?



That's fine if you do. I came for advice and would be a fool not to take it.

I can't help but think the only way the manufacturers could run i7 CPUs and the RAM, without heatsinks and fans is underpowering everything. Unless there's been a huge leap in technology, it just seems like putting a ¼ pint into a gallon drum. But the prospect of all that PC in a tiny, silent box is just so ..... cool!

Thanks for the offer of advice. I will almost certainly take it up. Posting details of what I'm looking at here.

I should have the sort of cash needed in a month or so. I usually source what I need from Novatech.co.uk They have been around for years. They do all their servicing onsite and have a great range. 

Pretty sure I will opt for Linux Mint.

On the bright side, I'll have the experience of the time I was using an £80 PC to regale to everyone. 

[jazzazz]

"I have thought about going back to a laptop"

I have both my Chromebook, which using that Chrome OS and Chrome browser all built into one, 4G of RAM works wonderfully fast, although now models with more and larger SSDs too. Beats the heck out of my 8G of RAM, of my MacMini Desktop, which I will always have a Desktop.

I do my CBing in bed every morning B4 getting up as now, then later bring my desktop out of sleep, for the rest of the day, that one connected directly to the internet with an Ethernet cable, and like a Dinosaur, my printer connected to that with a USB cable :-).

Always strange how long it takes to see y'all replies being on the WRONG SIDE OF THE POND, LOL, JUST KIDDING, and me here on the Left Coast of CommieFornia :-)

[mikkh]

I take it you feel the same way about all the mini-pcs available?

Nope, there are some good ones if you know what you're looking for and that doesn't always mean spending a ridiculous amount of money, just avoiding the real poor value/low spec ones.

I like the concept (small and quiet) but as a PC builder, there's little or no tinkering with the original machine - what you get, is what you're stuck with mostly.

[jimmy]

May 1, 2022 15:05:57 GMT jazzazz said:

"I have thought about going back to a laptop"

I have both my Chromebook, which using that Chrome OS and Chrome browser all built into one, 4G of RAM works wonderfully fast, although now models with more and larger SSDs too. Beats the heck out of my 8G of RAM, of my MacMini Desktop, which I will always have a Desktop.

I do my CBing in bed every morning B4 getting up as now, then later bring my desktop out of sleep, for the rest of the day, that one connected directly to the internet with an Ethernet cable, and like a Dinosaur, my printer connected to that with a USB cable :-).

Always strange how long it takes to see y'all replies being on the WRONG SIDE OF THE POND, LOL, JUST KIDDING, and me here on the Left Coast of CommieFornia :-)

Really like the idea of ChromeOS simply because of the Google association. 

As I said, I have been looking at Linux Mint, largely at your suggestion. It looks excellent. How do you rate it to ChromOS?

Understand completely how you feel about time differences. Most of my family live on an island off the East coast of Africa. Being the tropics, they tend to get up and go to bed with the sun. about 6am and 6pm. Though staying up late is always an option.

They are about 4 hours ahead of me. I call them at 8pm and it's midnight there!

[jimmy]

May 1, 2022 20:02:18 GMT mikkh said:

I take it you feel the same way about all the mini-pcs available?

Nope, there are some good ones if you know what you're looking for and that doesn't always mean spending a ridiculous amount of money, just avoiding the real poor value/low spec ones.

I like the concept (small and quiet) but as a PC builder, there's little or no tinkering with the original machine - what you get, is what you're stuck with mostly.

I'm taking advantage of the couple of months delay before I can actually buy a decent PC and looking around at what is available.



I like the Asus brand from past experience. It's always been well made. Is this still the case in your opinion?



Been looking at Asus range of mini PCs. They have i7 models but so far, I haven't found any vendors in the UK who sell them. I really want to get an idea of the prices frankly.



As I said, I will be buying through Novatech. I intend to use Linux, probably Mint. That was suggested by jazzazz who seems to be familiar with it. The information I've found so far confirms her opinion.

Novatech will install Linux for me, along with any upgrades I might need. I used to like the tinkering as well, but am at the stage now where its best to let professionals do these things, when I can.



I've also been looking at some of the comparison pages. Tom's hardware and UKpcmag for example.



There isn't any agreement among any of them really. That suggests minds are still being made up.



Strangely, Tom's Hardware is promoting Apple. I do hope they haven't succumbed to the Apple hype. So many, once good companys, seem to be selling out, or is that just me being old?  


jazzazz mentioned ChromeOS. Google has a good reputation and I do like their Chrome browser, though I am using Blaze!!!!



Still bashing through with my 80-buck PC. It is so incredibly slow. I needed to log into my bank today and it shut me down because I hadn't responded!



But once sites are loaded, they mostly seem to run well enough. Blaze blocks all the dynamic adverts which speeds things up hugely. I will look forward to getting back to something a bit faster. 

I have managed to get my MK 250 keyboard working. Seems it doesn't use Bluetooth after all. The drongle was in my now broken PC. It came with a wireless mouse, which sadly, I can't find. So both the USB ports are now blocked.


www.asus.com/uk/Displays-Desktops/Mini-PCs/Chrome-OS-devices/ASUS-Chromebox-4/techspec/

uk.pcmag.com/desktops/93306/the-best-windows-mini-pcs

www.bestproductsreviews.co.uk/Mini-PC-Windows?targetid=dsa-469483434121&matchtype=&device=c&campaignid=15560303680&creative=569420915980&adgroupid=126238267570&feeditemid=214426877019&loc_physical_ms=9045782&loc_interest_ms=&network=g&devicemodel=&placement=&keyword=$&target=&aceid=&adposition=&trackid=uk_all_ls_top_4_1&mId=407-132-4411&trackOld=true

www.tomsguide.com/uk/us/best-mini-pc.html

[jazzazz]

"How do you rate it to ChromOS?"

I love it. Like I said, with only 4G of RAM, this CB is very fast. Makes my 8G of RAM MacMini look like a tortouse, LOL

[jazzazz]

P.S. And I have 9 tabs open presently, my normal

[mikkh]

Interesting links and yes Asus are generally a reliable choice.

A quick glance at the CPU's they offer is about what I expected - avoid the Celeron one at all costs and that is a general rule of thumb for all PC's especially those Celerons with a J at the start.
Although the latest generation are actually not terrible, they're unlikely to be present in any currently offered online because they're still selling older models.

The i3 is OK for general surfing, but the i5 is the sweet spot and not much slower than the i7 - a couple of percent at most.

Pentium Gold are the sort of stepping between Celeron and i3 and are worth considering if the price is right.

On the other links I see they're pushing the Intel NUC and mostly ones over £500 rather than under, but there are plenty under £500 that are good enough.

[jazzazz]

"Twitter is something the birds do in the morning, not an activity on my PC or phone"


Me either, never gone there, never will :-)

[mikkh]

I did make an account years ago, but never really used it beyond day 1 when I made a couple of tweets of no importance whatsoever - much like most people who use it now!

Never even considered Instagram or TikTok which seem to be inhabited solely by attention seeking morons. At least Twitter pertains to be for more intelligent people, even if it's not on the whole.

#Whocaresabouthashtags

[jimmy]

May 3, 2022 17:18:15 GMT mikkh said:

Interesting links and yes Asus are generally a reliable choice.

A quick glance at the CPU's they offer is about what I expected - avoid the Celeron one at all costs and that is a general rule of thumb for all PC's especially those Celerons with a J at the start.
Although the latest generation are actually not terrible, they're unlikely to be present in any currently offered online because they're still selling older models.

The i3 is OK for general surfing, but the i5 is the sweet spot and not much slower than the i7 - a couple of percent at most.

Pentium Gold are the sort of stepping between Celeron and i3 and are worth considering if the price is right.

On the other links I see they're pushing the Intel NUC and mostly ones over £500 rather than under, but there are plenty under £500 that are good enough.

Thank for confirming the status of Asus. 
Thanks also for the information on i5 vs i7. I hadn't realised that. It does open the market somewhat. 
I'd like to say I rarely play games. I don't but you know how it is? Something comes along and you just have to. 

I am very keen on Jazzazz' suggestion of ChromeOS. 

[mikkh]

ChromeOS is OK if you can live with a minimalist smartphone like desktop layout.

I see it as a cynical way of offloading substandard hardware that is basically not good enough to run Windows or a full featured Linux.

This article highlights what I mean, although he's struggling to stretch it into 10 reasons
www.themobileindian.com/news/top-10-things-you-cant-do-on-a-chromebook-30945

And to clarify what I said about i5 and i7's, I meant in the top link you posted from Asus - those two CPU's are virtually identical in terms of speed/processing power and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference in daily use.

[jimmy]

May 7, 2022 10:52:07 GMT mikkh said:

ChromeOS is OK if you can live with a minimalist smartphone like desktop layout.

I see it as a cynical way of offloading substandard hardware that is basically not good enough to run Windows or a full featured Linux.

This article highlights what I mean, although he's struggling to stretch it into 10 reasons
www.themobileindian.com/news/top-10-things-you-cant-do-on-a-chromebook-30945

And to clarify what I said about i5 and i7's, I meant in the top link you posted from Asus - those two CPU's are virtually identical in terms of speed/processing power and you wouldn't be able to tell the difference in daily use.

Understood about Chrome OS. I'm liking it even more frankly!! I will read that link. Thanks so much.

I'd really like to load it into my £80 pc, but lack the confidence. 20 years ago, I'd have done that and pulled the thing apart several times by now. But I'm older and not necessarily wiser.
When I do manage to get a decent PC, I will be trying that though. 
It's occurred to me, it could be useful for a long term task of some kind, say monitoring sensors or such. 

Understand about what you mean regarding the Asus and i5 vs i7. Thank you for the clarification. I have started a ticket with Novatech, asking if they can source that Chromebox 4 with an i5 or and i7.

I'd cross my fingers but the crack would be heard in Moscow!

[jazzazz]

"ChromeOS is OK if you can live with a minimalist smartphone like desktop layout."

Sorry, but I have to disagree. I use both a MAC desktop, had a WindowsXP desktop that I converted to Linux (Mint 17), and there is nothing on this ChromeOS Chromebook, that I can't do that I do on my Desktop. Maybe it is just that I am not that demanding of a computer, but I have not run into anything yet, that I can not get done.

I am not a game player, but I am certain that you can play those too.

Here is a great Discussion Group, where you can read about them, interesting posts, and no joining is necessary
:-)>>

members.boardhost.com/Chromebook/index-1.html


By the way, "Minimalist Desktop type layout," everything looks exactly the same to me Here on my CB, as Chrome looks on my MAC. And this CB is way way faster, with half the RAM too :-)

[mikkh]

There are plenty of lightweight Linux 'distros' you could try - all can be run directly from a USB stick before you commit yourself to a full install.

Antix is a full featured desktop, perhaps too full featured - it's menu's are full of options that can get confusing as you try and navigate them all
It will run on very modest hardware though including claims to run in as little as 256 MB RAM which I doubt very much. I'd say 2 GB was more realistic.

Clear Linux is an interesting one. Developed by Intel and fully optimised for Intel CPU's
It is more minimal like ChromeOS and may be worth trying.

EasyOS (an offshoot of Puppy Linux that is well known in the 'lite' Linux category) is designed to be always used off the USB stick, but can be installed if required.
It cleverly loads the OS in RAM to run at maximum speed.

I recommend Balena Etcher as a tool to transfer all of these to a USB stick.
Make sure you use a good quality USB 3 stick in a USB 3 port to get best speed.

I'd probably start with EasyOS
distro.ibiblio.org/easyos/amd64/releases/dunfell/3.4.5/easy-3.4.5-amd64.img.gz

[jimmy]

Been looking at these on Amazon,

ASUS PN50 Barebone Mini PC (AMD Ryzen 7 4800U, 2 x SO-DIMM DDR4 3200 MHz, M.2 SATA/PCIe/NVMe, 2.5 Inch HDD/SSD Bay, Intel AX200 Wi-Fi 6, No OS) Priced around £530, though it's available elsewhere for £10-£20 cheaper.

Been doing a bit of reading, especially comparing the Intel i7 and Ryzen 7. Ryzen is generally suggested as being on a par with the Intel. Any comments on this?

The unit needs RAM, SSD and an OS.

RAM. I'd like to max it, at 64Gb. Crucial do this for about £260 I've looked at the 32Gb and though a lot cheaper, if I do need to upgrade later, it's just cash wasted frankly.

The other is a similar unit with a Ryzen 5 CPU. Asus PN50-BBR065MD AMD Renoir FP6 R5-4500U/ DDR4/ WiFi/ USB3.1 Mini PC Barebone System (Black)

It is about £100 less. As far as I can see, the specs are not that different. Been comparing the CPUs

Really appreciate some opinions.

www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-amd_ryzen_5_4500u-vs-amd_ryzen_7_4800u

amazon.co.uk/dp/B08BLGHW8R/?coliid=I7EV1JIM95F0F&colid=3TDK3G9UF0Y8H&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it&th=1

www.amazon.co.uk/PN50-BBR065MD-Renoir-R5-4500U-USB3-1-Barebone/dp/B08TGXXGMK/ref=asc_df_B08TGXXGMK/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=570435259588&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=10154126880013505704&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9045782&hvtargid=pla-1294737628710&psc=1&th=1&psc=1

amazon.co.uk/Crucial-CT2K32G4SFD832A-SODIMM-260-Pin-Memory/dp/B07ZLCVKPV/?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_w=DJhMO&content-id=amzn1.sym.822afc68-e2bb-4420-ac6e-1044cd2e7c1d&pf_rd_p=822afc68-e2bb-4420-ac6e-1044cd2e7c1d&pf_rd_r=VTS202Q80H5KNV8PM42J&pd_rd_wg=dwMnh&pd_rd_r=62865e5f-952f-48e1-93d8-5cd53a6afc43&ref_=pd_gw_ci_mcx_mi

[jimmy]

A closer look at the Ryzen 5 and it really is a major step down.

I'm hovering between the ASUS PN50 Barebone Mini PC with AMD Ryzen 7 4800U, and the ASUS CHROMEBOX4 i7 8GB 128GB

The i7 version is about £100 more and not actually in stock at this time, which is a downer.

Had a look at this site, comparing the Ryzen 7 with the i7. spacehop.com/ryzen-7-vs-i7/

Hmmm.

[mikkh]

For a thread that started with an £80 computer, this has now gone to the extreme opposite of cheap PC's

You're now talking about 64 GB's of RAM being a possible need? That's some heavy duty computing usually reserved for CAD workstations or small servers.

OK, lets start with the first question, Ryzen 7 v i7 both in the laptop variants. In the CPU's you mention, even the Ryzen 5 is vastly superior to the i7 in the Asus Chromebox4 with double the multi core speed and better graphics. As a general rule of thumb Intel CPU's have better single core speeds, but struggle to match AMD in multi core speeds.

The spacehop link is not really relevant because it discusses 'high end' CPU's which are definitely not in mini PC's. It's far too much information, but also very vague because it makes no direct comparisons until near the end when it talks about an old Ryzen and a 7th generation Intel CPU, but then claims to be 'best in 2022' in the title!

I take a far more simplistic approach when comparing CPU's at www.cpubenchmark.net/ I know the numbers from dozens of PC's I've used/built over the years and have a basic formula of 2000 single thread rating and 4000 average CPU being good enough for basic computing needs. The higher the better obviously, but 3000/1500k is a pretty good PC that can handle almost anything. Don't be thinking you need to reach those numbers though. I'm currently using an i3 that benchmarks at 2500/6.8k it sails through anything I need to do including occasional video editing.

[jimmy]

Well, to be fair, the £80. PC is a stop gap while I get the cash and information to buy something decent. (And it does try my patience!!!).

Thanks for all the feedback. This is why I asked, because despite of all my research, I'm still lost.

Take your point about the 64Gb RAM. I hadn't realised.

Thanks for the info on AMD. Again, all my research showed tons of differences, but what they actually mean is another matter.

I realise the mini PC concept is new and a little controversial at this time. The size and silence are what I find most attractive.

I'm looking for something that won't be obsolete too soon and which can do the things I want to do. What they are, I simply can't say until I get the notion and just have to do them. I can live without gaming, frankly. But I do like to play about with graphics, especially, photo-editing.

At this point, I'm looking for something to aim at. AMD Ryzen 7, from what you describe, seems to be the one to look at. It's pricy, but around the same price or less than similar desktops on sale at the moment.

And thank you again for your input. Always welcome. Look forward to any further gems of information.

[mikkh]

A mini PC is basically a laptop in a box and inherits most of a laptops problems.

They're not as thin or cramped as a laptop which helps in cooling, but they use the same low power components and the CPU's are often under clocked to further help in heat dissipation.

On-board graphics are the norm which 'borrow' RAM from the main RAM and whereas 8 GB is enough (for normal use) in a desktop PC with a separate graphics card, it could struggle in a laptop or mini PC.

16 GB is a bit of an overkill, but more or less guarantees you'll have enough and future proofs it a bit more.

Future proofing is a bit limited on mini PC's though because the graphics and CPU are hard wired to the motherboard - you're basically stuck with them unless you've got a degree in electronics and a soldering iron, not to mention access to laptop parts.