Sapphire Graphcs cards are garbage

[jojo]

Just had money refunded for the 3rd time because a graphics card I've bough has been faulty.

I don't recall the manufacturer of the first, but the last two were from Sapphire, completely different vendors.

I've done an extensive search of the web to see if there are any issues with my MB. I have even contact the manufacturer, Asus, who have confined they know of no issues.

The only explanation can be that the Graphics cards made by Sapphire are utter rubbish.


Dam that feels good to get off my chest.

[mikkh]

According to wikipedia (ok not the most reliable source sometimes) they are the Worlds largest manufacturer of AMD based graphics cards, producing close on 2 million cards a year.
There were a number of budget end cards I would avoid if possible at one time - Sparkle was one because of the weedy inadequate fans they often used, Sapphire may well have been another, but it doesn't ring alarm bells like Sparkle still does, so I can't be certain.

If they are the Worlds largest as wikipedia suggests, you would assume Google would be full of similar tales of woe regarding their unreliability

www.ranker.com/list/the-best-video-card-manufacturers/computer-hardware

This list shows them way down the list (just above Sparkle) but I see lots of names from the past that no longer exist and a lot of modern companies not even present, so that's out of date info as far as I'm concerned and I can't say I've seen that site before either.

You've either been extremely unlucky, or your board has a selective fault. Were the cards just blindly exchanged/refunded in the name of good customer relations? Or did they test them and agree they were faulty? Did you get to test them in a different machine yourself? I can only remember a couple of times I've had to exchange things over the past 20 years or so, and logically I'd be thinking the fault could be the motherboard, maybe the PSU even - despite it's relative newness

[jojo]

In each case the companies did test the cards. Amazon refunded me immediately, but said if, after testing, it was my fault or there were no faults, then I would be billed again. Novatech insisted on testing before they refunded and said the card was faulty.

As I said, I don't recall the first exactly, but I'm almost certain they too made me wait while they tested it. They refunded because they didn't have that model any more

I've joined a forum dedicated to Elite Dangerous and other stuff from the same company.

To be honest, most of it is filled with sycophancy especially about any game designer, and basic nerdy fantasising.

But they do have a very small hardware section, tucked down in a corner where it's hard to find!!

Anyway, I stated two thread recently, one asking what is the top MB, the other, what is the top Graphics card.

The results so far are, by a considerable margin, for both Asus. forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=42354&page=2 and forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=42175&page=3

Not by any means a conclusive result, but since these guys tend to give their stuff more punishment than most machines, some of their stuff is 4 core minimum for example, it's not to be sniffed at.

I've placed an order for an Asus card: www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/nvidiageforcegraphicscards/nvidiagtx760series/gtx760-dc2oc-2gd5.html

[mikkh]

Biting the bullet eh, that's a big step up in performance (and price)

The only thing about stepping up to the big boys like this, is it will almost certainly require extra power (overall watts and power leads to attach to the beast)

Did a bit of research and it looks like it needs an 8 pin connector and minimum 500 watts PSU. You're only just in that range if I remember right and you also like multiple drives which could be a bridge too far. Hard drives don't use a lot of watts, but it could be the difference between it having enough power or not. It should still work, but be aware an under-powered card can underclock itself if it's not getting enough power and you may not notice having come from a very weak GPU.

Do some benchmarks to make sure

[jojo]

Understand mikkh.

My PSU is 600Watt. My drives are SSDs. Other than those and the MB and a 2 case fans, there isn't anything else inside.

I moved up because I decided not to buy a new machine after all. My current machine, for all its olde worlde charme is a reliable beast. So I had a bit more cash left over and went for that card.

I contacted Asus about the previous cards, asking if my set up might have comparability issues. They said it would be fine.

Novatech say the card will need:
Max Power Usage 170W
Minimum PSU Requirement 500W
Required Power Connectors 2 x 6-pin

I'm not really sure what you mean by the 8 pin connector or what they mean by the two 6 pin. No matter how much research I've done, I've never seen any references to either of those terms.

But I can sit around forever and never figure this out. If I get a reliable board, from a good manufacturer, I can at least start to learn where I need to go.

Anyway, when it comes I can tell you everything and hope you're feeling fit so you can suggest what I do/try next.

[jojo]

This looks interesting: www.techpowerup.com/reviews/ASUS/GeForce_GTX_760_Direct_Cu_II_OC/1.html

I have one cable with twin 6 pin PCI Express leads attached. Though they are in series. There's also a spare Molex and a SATA Power


Correction. My PSU is 500W

[mikkh]

The link you posted and ones I researched clearly shows a single 8 pin. I've got to assume there's a 2 x 6 pin to 1 x 8 pin converter in the box for them to say that 2 x 6 pin are required

You can get single 6 pin to 8 pin converters, but they aren't a good idea because a 6 pin can only handle a certain amount of watts, which may not be enough and could damage the card

You'll have to see what they supply, worse case scenario is there's no converter at all, which doesn't seem likely on quite an expensive card. Best case scenario is it does indeed need 2 x 6 with no adapter at all required.

[jojo]

I've been looking into the issue, since you mentioned it yesterday. Finding any source which has consistent information is difficult, the site below suggests the power is from a single 6 pin!

I've found several sources which suggest that the extra pins on an 8 pin are actually sense pins, intended to monitor and adjust, where the PSU is compatible.

At the bottom is a collection of images I've been accumulating on the subject. I won't take any as definitive, getting the actual board and seeing what is there is what I really need. But the images so seem to offer a number of possibilities. Ignore the top LH image. My train of thought at the time was the featured 'adaptors' which seem to be everywhere!

A rather more serious problem has ocureed to me, that the csa of the PSU output cores is quite small. Given the currents I would have expected rather bigger cores. Can I ask, could you look inside your machine, and see if the cores on supplying some of the heavier pars are heating up excessively?

www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/geforce_gtx_760_asus_directcu_oc_review,5.html

[mikkh]

Not quite sure what you're asking me to check, I know next to nothing about electronics and don't own any electrical testing equipment. I invariably diagnose faults by a process of elimination and use a basic sledgehammer approach of replacing parts I think are causing the problem till it works. I'm probably not as smart as you think I am, but thanks for your confidence.

I remember over a decade ago AMD recommended a minimum 400W PSU for their XP range of CPU's and I've gradually increased that over the years whenever I buy a new PSU. My main PC has a 750w PSU and my spare one (for my personal use) is 700W. I have other lesser ones for doing repairs on older machines, but as you can see I'm probably over gunning quite a bit - mostly because I used to be an avid gamer and there's no such thing as too much power in my mind.

What I can tell you is both the 700 and 750 have dedicated 6+2 pin graphics card power leads, because the manufacturers assume (correctly in most instances) you'll be using a monster graphics card with that amount of watts. Your 500 watts is probably aimed at the non gamer end of the market where the cheaper cards either require no extra power or use a single 6 pin

I guess what I'm saying is you may need a new PSU, something like this....

www.web-systems.co.uk/?page=Products&pid=7024

which is considerably cheaper than direct from them

www.corsair.com/en/cx-series-cx600m-modular-atx-power-supply-600-watt-80-plus-bronze-certified-modular-psu

[jojo]

I understand you don't know about electronics. I posted as part of the train of though really. It's interesting that the extra pins on and 8 pin are sensors, that is feed back, allowing for finer adjustments. On my supply, these are grounded, so will have no effect.

I've found a load of PSUs at Novatech. Are you familiar with the quality of their brand? www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/powersupplies/

I take you point about needing a bigger PSU and will look into that. But since you suggested 600 Watt is the minimum is seems pointless, I may as well spend a bit more and get something that will do the job comfortably. 750W as you have or higher.

This for example, since you seem to rate Corsair www.novatech.co.uk/products/components/powersupplies/651wto850w/cp-9020061-uk.html

[mikkh]

I was thinking more getting the correct dedicated power lead than actual watts, which is why I suggested that one.
It's also modular which helps when sorting out the spaghetti in a case.

Free delivery makes the 750 w a good buy though

I'm not familiar with the Novatech branded ones, they look too cheap to be any good. Certainly won't have 80 plus certification or be modular for that price.
And the watts rating you can take with a pinch of salt on the budget models - not worth the saving in the long run

[jojo]

OK I'll order the Corsair 750W.

Thanks tons mikkh. There's a special place in heaven for people like you.